I don’t know, sometimes the though of “what if all my leftist ideas are false? What if trans people are just mentally ill? What if gay people are just deviants?”
I honestly really don’t like it…

It’s good to question your beliefs I guess, it’s how you grow, but it sometimes makes me really uncomfortable. Why does this happen? Can I stop it? Should I?

  • sturger@sh.itjust.works
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    35 minutes ago

    If you feel crazy because you don’t fit in, it’s entirely possible you’re not the crazy one. It’s entirely possible a large portion of society is on another bender.

    I found the book, “Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds” by Charles Mackay helpful.
    It was first published in 1841, so it’s in the public domain and available online. I found my copy in a used bookstore for a $1.
    Mackay documents many of the public manias that overtook society up to that point. He describes dozens of them and remember, his list stops in the mid-1800’s.
    Being aware of this pattern helps me to realize that a large number of humans are highly illogical. It helps me to understand that yes, a large number of people can all go off the deep end. It’s not me, it’s them. Notably, I can’t do anything about it. All I can do is lie low and ride it out.

  • stupidcasey@lemmy.world
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    2 hours ago

    You should always Question everything, If someone tells you not to question it, question it Harder.

    If it is the Truth then it doesn’t matter if you Question it or not, and nobody should care if you question it

    If it’s a Lie, then You need to know why you’re being lied to, you need to know who benefits from it, you need to know if the Lie was worth suppression of the Truth.

    If your life is truly better with the Lie it is always better to know and make that decision for yourself, never let others dictate what you believe because it is better for them, If you are going to follow a Lie make sure it is in your best interest. Because anyone will tell you a lie to help themselves but no one will willingly work against their own self interest.

  • surewhynotlem@lemmy.world
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    2 hours ago

    I always look at it this way. So what?

    What if I’m wrong and gay people are deviants? Well if I’m wrong, they get to live life like they want to. No problem there.

    What if trans people are mentally ill? Well, we don’t stop boob jobs or tattoos, and if we’re claiming trans is ill then those are too. So no problem with that either.

    Think of the consequences of your actions, and if those consequences are OK even if you’re wrong, then you can stop worrying.

  • naught101@lemmy.world
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    16 hours ago

    No way, that’s just science, baby! (Edit: OK, and philosophy)

    I think those questions need to be followed through with a chain of reasoning and questions, not denial. There’s usually lots of options.

    So for that “gay people are deviants” question, a “no they aren’t” answer isn’t helpful, because it’s faith based, which leads to a shutdown of thinking and curiosity.

    Another line might be: if they are, then does that mean that the tens or hundreds of other animal species with documented existence of homosexuality are also deviants? Can an animal be a deviant? Seems unlikely… Does that mean that maybe deviance is a dodgy concept? What does it actually mean? Does it mean a thing is fundamentally bad, or does it just mean that it doesn’t fit with a particular value system? If that’s the case, and I personally know a bunch of gay people who are really lovely people, is it possible that it’s the value system that’s the problem, not the gay people?

    There’s usually plenty of other chains of thought that will get you to a place like this. Doing this kind of thought exploration also means that when you come up against someone making that argument in public, then you have a better idea where you stand, and you can potentially engage constructively with them, if they seem open to it.

    • stupidcasey@lemmy.world
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      1 hour ago

      EDIT: Fixed grammar with AI.

      The word deviant doesn’t have a concrete meaning in scientific terms.

      So, no—objectively speaking, gay people are not “deviant,” since morality is a human construct. (And even if it weren’t, that would be a philosophical question.)

      The best way I could reframe this question is:

      A. Are we evolutionarily predisposed to find people with alternative* sexual preferences distasteful or unpleasant?

      B. Are alternative* sexual preferences evolutionarily harmful to society?

      C. Are alternative* sexual preferences harmful to an individual’s own evolutionary success?

      D. If any of the above are true, is the psychological or societal damage so detrimental—either to the individual or to society—that it would still be preferable to engage in alternative* sexual desires?

      In this context, “alternative” refers to anything outside of a heterosexual relationship. However, these questions can be narrowed down to whatever specific sexual preferences you are inquiring about.


      I won’t offer my own opinion on this, nor will I present any scientific evidence. But I will say this: I don’t think the issue is as black and white as some might assume.

  • boolean_sledgehammer@lemmy.world
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    1 day ago

    Right or wrong is rarely as binary as you seem to be imagining. It’s a spectrum. Alignment with reality is contingent upon a habit of seeking better information. If better information comes along, any intellectually healthy person should be willing to accept it and integrate it into their understanding of the world.

    Also - cultivate a habit of knowing that it’s ok to be wrong. Your beliefs don’t define you as much as HOW you choose to shape your beliefs.

    We have pattern-seeking brains that instinctually crave a sense of certainty that rarely exists in reality. We always have to be aware of that. We also live in a society that unfortunately reinforces this tendency.

    Don’t strive to be “right.” Strive to be well-informed.

  • darthelmet@lemmy.world
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    22 hours ago

    Why does it happen? Because the world is crazy and if nobody does anything about it then it starts to feel like you’re the crazy one. It also doesn’t help that there’s all this propaganda out there to make you feel that way.

    But what do you do about it? Questioning your beliefs on a factual or analytical level is very useful. I don’t think I could have reached my current beliefs in the first place without that openness to new information and critical eye towards what I knew.

    But I think the important thing is to separate that out from what you VALUE. What are the things which you care about independent of what the facts are? Do you value treating people kindly? Then it shouldn’t matter if it turned out that some other group was actually inferior. That shouldn’t change that core value. Now if you only value people based on how useful they are, then thinking that someone else was inferior would change how you treat them.

    Thinking about my own beliefs and values, my political beliefs have changed a lot over the years, from vaguely American liberalism to some kind of communism, but my values haven’t changed. That’s because the values nominally espoused by the mythological American national identity are good ones. What’s not to like about freedom, equality, and the pursuit of happiness? Democracy sounds great!

    But as I learned more about the world, it became more clear how America failed to live up to those values and more precisely, didn’t really hold those values, or at the very least had subtly different meanings of them that created wide gaps in how those values were acted on.

    “Freedom” in America is something you can buy. The more money and power you have, the more free you are. And the freedom to use that power to exploit others consequently means you’re less free if you’re poor.

    “Equality of opportunity” that is blind to historic inequality and power structures creates this illusion that everyone had a fair shot to succeed or fail and therefor “deserve” where they end up where in reality we never started on equal footing and where we end up is largely an accident of birth. Rich people aren’t necessarily better or harder working than poor people. People don’t actually get to keep the value of their work, it’s just not taken through taxes, but by capitalists in the form of profits. (Also, this is another values thing, but even if the assertions of meritocracy and equality of opportunity were true, I still don’t think a society with this level of poverty and inequality is an acceptable outcome even if people somehow ended up where they were through their own failures.)

    Democracy in an unequal society where the rich can put their thumbs on the scale isn’t really democracy. Plus when you learn about the founding of that “democracy”, you learn how explicitly it was set up to favor those powerful few over the many. This is kind of one of the things that makes me feel crazy. I didn’t read about this on some obscure internet blog or commie book, literally everyone in the country learns about the founding in school and more or less learns its anti-democratic bend. It’s not hidden, it’s just that everyone kind of forgets it or doesn’t really internalize the way it relates to our experiences. Also, if we like democracy so much, why do we effectively suspend that democracy for half our waking lives when we go into work? Why shouldn’t people have a say in that? “Nobody’s forcing you to work” doesn’t really work when the alternative is starvation and homelessness.

    I still want the ideal, I just recognize the ways I’ve been lied to by people who claim to share that ideal. And that’s where you have to be careful. Not everyone is honest about what they want. ( Sometimes even with themselves) There’s the saying on the left “scratch a liberal and a fascist bleeds” because for some of these people, when you really confront their beliefs with evidence that contradicts it, instead of growing and changing, they just reveal their true colors. Some people who talk about equality while being racist aren’t just misinformed, they actually do believe in hierarchy and the concept of equality is merely a way to rationalize away the that hierarchy. Sometimes you show people how the US fails to be democratic and they reveal that they don’t even think democracy is good. That people are too stupid or evil to rule over themselves.

    So yeah. Test your beliefs about the world, but the only way you have a metric to test them against is if you know what your values are in the first place.

  • pinball_wizard@lemmy.zip
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    1 day ago

    The mile markers along the road to truth are ideas we used to believe were true.

    Further truth can only be obtained by holding currently accepted truth to the highest standards of scrutiny.

    • naught101@lemmy.world
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      16 hours ago

      This is good, but I’d add that you can get closer, and you can get closer faster, but truth will always be over the horizon.

  • AA5B@lemmy.world
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    1 day ago

    Ok, let’s run that thought experiment, what if we’re wrong?

    All too often, even if my premise is wrong, I’d get to the same results. Even if I agree with their premise, they are monsters. However you want to marginalize people for different preferences or presentation or not matching their body or skin color or gender, that’s no excuse for the abuse, taking away human rights, taking away normal accommodations for everyday life. Treat people like people.

    Equally the thought experiment just proves the original point. Let’s assume there are people who believe the government is full of waste, fraud and abuse, and we need to fix that. They haven’t presented anything to convince us that’s true, their actions cutting people and agencies without investigation, due process, contractual requirements, or regard for constitutional checks and balances is quickly a much bigger problem. Then you have those same people acting above the law, a very suspicious correlation between cuts and personal enrichment of those involved, and you’re firmly in bizarro world territory where the asylum is run by the real lunatics. Even assuming the worst of people employed by the federal government, I can’t conceive of a way this isn’t far worse, proving my original belief

  • je_skirata@lemmy.today
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    2 days ago

    It’s a good thing to question your beliefs every once in a while. Sometimes people get things wrong, and sometimes ideas need re-evaluated.

    The way I look at gay/trans/etc is to take MLK Jr’s advice: judge people by the content of their character.

  • Hegar@fedia.io
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    2 days ago

    It’s important to question your beliefs when presented with evidence. My views on pacificism have loosened a lot, for example.

    But the two view you mention are ones where the left is objectively correct. Homosexual behavior is a biological fact in almost all animals and non-binary gender systems exist across the breadth of human cultures.

    Any belief system which serves as a permission structure for brutalizing others can safely be rejected as false.

  • Opinionhaver@feddit.uk
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    1 day ago

    There’s one single thing in the entire universe that I’m absolutely certain of - something nothing could ever change my mind about: the fact that it feels like something to be. That there’s qualia, subjective experience. I could be a simulation, a brain in a vat, or something else entirely - but it’s undeniable that it is like something to be whatever “me” is. Everything else is up for debate.

    Now, sure - there are things it would take a lot to convince me otherwise about, but I’m also not married to my ideas. I don’t attach my identity to them. I’ve been wrong before, and I’m almost certainly wrong about plenty of things even now. I don’t reject ideas just because I don’t like them. There are uncomfortable truths in this world, and not believing them doesn’t make them untrue. Even politically, it would be statistically absurd to think one side is right about everything and the other side is wrong about everything. It’s a mix. The challenge is figuring out where you are mistaken.

    As for the examples you mentioned - homosexuality and transsexuality are human-made labels, ways to describe patterns we see. But like all labels, they’re rough generalizations. The differences between individuals even within these groups are vast - so much so that it starts to put the usefulness of the label itself into question. Personally, I’m just me. Tomorrow I’ll be a slightly different version of me. I don’t even fully identify with who I was yesterday - let alone some rigid label that society wants to stick on me.