I am aware of
- Sea-lioning
- Gaslighting
- Gish-Galloping
- Dogpiling
I want to know I theres any others I’m not aware of
After an event happens, many people convince themselves they saw it coming all along even if they had no idea.
Everyone is an expert on everything… Worse now because of LLMs
Phrasing something as protecting children… The ultimate form of manipulation
Any logical falacy
One I see people use frequently and I’m not sure they realize it’s a bad argument is the fallacy of relative privation.
“X is bad. We should do something to fix X.”
“Y is so much worse. I can’t believe you want to fix X when we need to fix Y.”
Both X and Y can be bad and need to be fixed. Fixing one doesn’t preclude fixing the other.
An alternate form of this is:
“A is bad”
“B is worse, so A is fine.”
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Is okay to choose A simply because B is quite literally orange hitler?
Obviously yes. Doing so isn’t saying A is fine, doing so is saying B is worse, and bad is still better than worse.
If you tried to say that there was no reason to be concerned with A because B was worse, that’s a fallacy. But acknowledging that one of two options, while still bad, is LESS bad, isn’t a fallacy. That’s just being realistic.
Is there a name for the thing where you’ll make an argument with like 3 distinct points supporting it, and the other person will attack only one, and claim the whole thing is in their favor?
Like, “You can’t cast two leveled spells in a turn, and you’re silenced, and you’re out of spell slots, so you can’t cast another fireball”
“No, I have another spell slot from my ring. Fireball time!”
cherry picking
Innuendo studios has a nice series of videos on this on YouTube
I was going to recommend this very thing.
Whataboutism
“Russia invaded ukraine! Putin must be held accountable!”
“Yeah well what about Iraq, 2003???”
Down with the empire! https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viriathus
That’s the “tu quoque”, aka “you too” argument evasion
In 2014, the United States imperialist empire with the CIA supported a coup of a democratically elected president. This gave rise to ultra-nationalist elements in the country to come to power. Some might call these people Neo-Nazis. A liberal perspective is ignoring the fact that the United States is an imperialist empire. A liberal perspective is ignoring the fact that the United States is an imperialist empire. That now is pulling back from its soft power and moving more towards, I would say, hard power. We will live in an age of normalizing tactical nukes which are lower yield. We will continue bombing the shit out of poor people while playing both sides. Neoliberalism is a right-wing ideology. It was an attempt to end all wars by putting them on pause. But I would think because you’re alive now and you’re capable of using the internet, you would realize that we live in the era of asymmetrical warfare and proxy wars. The world relies on global trade, but now that the rich have hoarded the wealth so like all wars, All wars are banker wars, but yet there is no war but the class war. In America, we only have a service-based economy. So the only way we can produce income, other than working at a cheeseburger stand, for vapid, useful idiots of empire, is to join the military and resign ourselves to being a part of a machine that murders and commits genocide. There is a song called Love Me Love Me, I’m a liberal. And if you actually listen to the lyrics, you will realize that history is repeating itself. Depending on how young you are, you might be forced into the military sooner or later. I would learn about the opium wars and then think about how China maybe is giving us a dose of our own medicine. I would also look up the Imperial Boomerang. Or also what the military uses “blowback”. It’s up to you if you want to be a snarky liberal or some cultish tanky but at the end of the day we are reaching the singularity. We live in the lowest common denominator and the likes of Edward Bernays or maybe look up Alan Dulles you will soon realize that you live in a world that’s merely but a dream. We are master’s manage perception. We live in North Korea with the mixture of say like Disneyland but without your wallet. With Israel, there will be a pullback optically to make it seem that we’re upset with what they’re doing. But in reality, we are working in the background, handling all the background round processes and even boots on the ground. If you do not have nuclear weapons, you do not have national sovereignty, especially when because of Trump and because of Biden, sleepy, limp dick what was left of the rules-based order is completely gone. The rich will use us as pawns, and you are probably a liberal who is playing the role of useful idiot. You can, if you’d like, go online and look up the left and right paradigm. People outside of the United States, like in Europe, view us as solely a right-wing country. But we’re interesting because we’re in imperialist power. Which makes it glaringly obvious if you have full spectrum understanding that capitalism is not a long-term strategy. The world hates us and fears us because of our brutality. During World War II, the United States financed and supported Hitler. This was an attempt to weaken the Russians. And then after the war, the Catholic Church and the United States government trafficked Nazis all over the world even look up Operation Gladio. But they also sent them to South America and to the United States to work on our rocket program to fight the Russians. Now China and Russia are both capitalist countries and now communism, any little inkling of, is completely eradicated and it seems that capitalism causes a tremendous amount of violence. Now, if you look at the money supply, hyperinflation, we are synthesizing ourselves down to the lowest common denominator. We do not have any money in the system to do anything because we funnel it all to our military, which is somewhat a socialist entity in that people join the military because their poor. But even the military and the veterans are treated like shit after their service… Which is kind of funny to me Because you basically joined a volunteer army and somehow your ignorance somehow makes you not culpable for murdering people in other countries. It blows my mind. I Mean these people are somewhat victims as well as victimizers, but at the root of it, it’s the lack of self-awareness possibly reading comprehension or just even motivation due to a lethargic mind. I have lived on this planet long enough to know we are living in a spectrum of decline and things are not going to get better. I also know when I was younger I had stupid opinions and as I got older those opinions changed. I’m not too interested in the lingo of the internet, but more combating disinformation. Also, I’m not a big fan of China’s president or Russia’s president. And you have to remember they are capitalistic and they probably have imperialist ambitions. They probably would like to be the next hegemon. Anyways, it’s a can of worms and everybody’s askew. When I see bad things happen in this country or Abroad., I’m not like, oh my god, the humanity. I’m more like, oh that makes sense. Why don’t you give this document a gander and enrich yourself to a more mature viewpoint. Cheers https://www.brookings.edu/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/06_iran_strategy.pdf
What’s the word for dumping a novel of slop like this?
Making an argument. What you did is called “ad hominom”
New copypasta just dropped everyone!
This is satire right lol? The utter lack of formattinf gives it away. Otherwise it’s just totally unhinged
Speaking of bad faith techniques: ad hominem.
If it makes you feel any better society is completely fucked in say 50 years and there will be a collapse/catastrophe. You will never have to worry about this ever again.
Check out Rational Wiki’s page on logical fallacies https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Logical_fallacy
all of them, and are done by propaganda bots, like from russia, and israel. also trying to do the both sides argument, while ignoring that the other side is the one perpetrating it.
It must be nice knowing that you’re so correct that everyone who disagrees with you must be a bot.
You forget the most common one of all, lying.
That’s part gishgalloping part gaslighting, no?
I love this idea of defining lying using other manipulation techniques when lying itself is such a simple thing in comparison
Is there a word for dragging the argument to near-unrelated topics? E.g, post about lemmy.ml having comments on whether Ukraine has a nazi government.
I believe that’s “whataboutism”?
“Thought-terminating clichés”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thought-terminating_cliché
Also… I don’t think it has a name, but dubiously claiming any of these examples in an argument. Maybe it’d just be called “deflection”.
I’ve seen so many valid arguments shutdown as whataboutism, sealioning, concern trolling when they were valid arguments. It’s just as much bullshit as actually doing any of those things.
Appeal to fallacies is the self-important idiot’s way out of replying to someone’s argument.
Fallacy accusations.
When someone does not want to argue about your points they will attack the way you used to made them. If you check hard enough you can find fallacies in most online conversations. So if someone wants they could easily accuse anyone of making this or that fallacy. Some of them being also kind of subjective. Was this a valid example or was it a strawman?
They would just change the debate subject and put you on the defensive defending yourself of making fallacies.
I just usually point out this attitude and end the debate when this happens.
Is there a fallacy fallacy? where people assume that because something has a fallacy its wrong, or they accuse something of having a non-existant fallacy?
There is indeed
There are a few phallic fallacies for sure.
A fallacy matters if it’s central to proving the argument, otherwise it probably doesn’t. Eg Bringing up an anecdote, or a subjective experience as a way of illustrating a point could be said to be fallacious, but is not, if the argument is well supported enough that would stand without it.
I just had an argument where I ended my point with the words “this is a pure could have been:” and added a very likely scenario that may well could have come to pass it some events were different. Obviously it was speculation and not central to the previous argument, but in my estimation likely.
Then other person instead of responding to actual points took the last part and accused me of should’a, would’a, could’a.
Dude, yes! But not the point, also I was the one that pointed it out. The type of person that would explain to a comedian their own joke.
Man that’s such a strawman, you’re completely misrepresenting why they bring up fallacies.
The one I see the most is just playing dumb and pretending not to understand basic things
Context?
That may or may not be a technique.
Depending on what they are doing, it can be a form of sea-lioning.
Sometimes they’re genuinely dumb, but often it’s obvious that they know, and they know you know.
That would be sea-lioning.
It’s bad food. I get into bad hungry defensive moods with bad food.